"Survey said..."
I like that phrase from the Family Feud television show. I appreciate all of the comments regarding church membership. Some have posted on the blog and others have sent email. I have enjoyed open discussion with our staff, elders, and Area Superintendent over this past week as well. The Survey Said: the majority opinion from each of the above groups is that something needs to change. For the good of the local church we need more people engaged in membership.
The consensus of those surveyed was that membership should be limited to Christ followers who share an affinity with the vision and mission of our local church. That adhering to doctrine and testimonies is important to the body life of the fellowship and for the personal discipleship of the attender but should not be a stopper for membership.
One person suggested we could view church membership similar to how we credential our pastors. As a denomination we "record" what God has ordained and issue a license to pastors for public ministry. Likewise, through membership we could simply acknowledge the redemptive work of God in an attender's life and welcome them into fellowship.
All of this leads me to another question for discussion, "How then do we discern acceptability for leadership in the local meetinghouse if we are not screening for it in the membership process?" Is there a practical, effective way to identify spiritual gifts, and the biblical standards and qualifications that are required to lead or teach in a local church?
Thanks for stopping by!
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Adrian
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The screening is the testimony from other members regarding the candidates suitability for every incremental prililage. Different privilages requiring unique testimonial recommendation.
ReplyDeleteMembership.
Voting prililage.
Teaching.
Administrative leadership.
Make Disciples.
ReplyDeleteSet an environment of freedom and watch what happens.
The functioning of the business aspect of doing church should be handled by trained, paid people skilled at the task.
The rest is for the laity and I believe should be para-church organizations, separate from the fellowship.
The ministries of the whole should be few and carefully chosen. Identify a few, pursue them passionately and in these things be the absolute best we can be.
WHEFC is spread to thin. We do alot of things but do we excel at any of them?
Participation in a ministry should be a priviledge to look forward to, not a duty or responsibility. Why would someone become a disciple or a member if they can serve without being one? I don't believe participation is a means of discipling, it should be a result of being discipled.
If things are to change, let's change them.
To be honest, I don't believe we desire change but we will allow alittle teaking, here and there. That's extent of our "making disciples", isn't? We teach people to stick to the process and get tweaked along the way but never go after radical transformation. The truth be told. that process is little more than spiritual cowardice.
The government will sooner or later set its sights on the church and change the way they are funded. The beast never settles for less and must be fed. The Body must begin developing a new business system now. When the changes happen it may be too late.
This is an opportunity to truly impact the Body as whole, if we can get beyond ourselves and allow Jesus to show us where He is leading.
In John 15:15,16, our Lord said,
"No longer do I call you servants, for a servant does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I heard from My Father I have made known to you. 16 You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you".
Are we servants who can never know what He is about or are we friends, as the sign out front proclaims us to be, who He tells all the time what the Father is doing?
Do we dare risk everything in following Jesus into the future? Do we as a fellowship have the courage to truly change?
Again, are we merely servants who know nothing or are we His friends who hear, listen, trust and obey?
John 10:27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me".
Have a great day.
Carry on!
I agree with Monkey Boy :) re: the testimony of other believers on someone's giftedness. More importantly, the Spirit Himself will confirm in that person a call to a particular gift. The Spirit is not reliant on our processes and as He has always done, He will make known to the person what they should do. The real question is our sensitivity to Him. Once the Spirit nudges a person, they can then approach others (preferably mature believers) to enter into the discerning process with them.
ReplyDeleteNarrowminded,
ReplyDeleteI am sorry but I cannot accept your comment today. It contains more than one QUESTION! Can you resubmit it using proper blog protocol? :-)
Shawn, You are a very smart man and spiritually discerning. I love you man!
Define believer.
ReplyDeleteDefine giftedness.
Define mature believer.
Describe the "nudge" of the Spirit.
How does an immature believer discern between the Spirit and the flesh?
How does one dicern between the call of the Spirit and our natural desires?
How should leadership identify mature believers?
Forgive me but agreeing with the Monkey opens one up to serious questioning of ones reason.
Is all of this simple judgement?
Ph.d,
I was wrong, you are right, ASK AWAY!!
I want to know what Shawn said!
Carry on!
i said something to his last post.
ReplyDeletei think the best way to discern leadership qualities is to become friends with them. if we do not know the person who wants to lead, they are not allowed to lead. we need to know them. 'we' being those who decide. once the 'we' gets to know that person, then they can discern their leadership potential. make sense?
Makes sense to me. Want to start a church?
ReplyDeleteDilige, et quod vis fac
ReplyDeleteI thought Marino was Italiano and not Latin? Is the guy speaking in tongues or what? :-) "Love, and do what you will" ... is membership really that simple?
ReplyDeleteJust read Shawns comment on the previous thread. This needs to be formmatted as a forum, I would have missed what his thoughts were had not PhD. commented on them.
ReplyDeleteI ask again, how does anyone KNOW the spiritual condition of another? How do we judge that? Are we supposed to judge that? Does that even matter?
I agree with the Swami, the old model isn't working, hasn't for awhile now.
I think it all boils down to desire. If someone finds it desirable to become a member they will do what is needed to become one. By hook or by crook they'll meet the criteria. Real or phony, they'll get in, if they desire it enough.
I say we let them and let Jesus sort it out.
He's re-dressing His Bride, He has the right to do so. Let's rest in Him and let Him have His way.
Peace
Carry on!
Narrow,
ReplyDelete"Real or phony, they'll get in, if they desire it enough."
"I say we let them and let Jesus sort it out." AMEN!
As for another's spiritual condition, we can't really know that. We can judge their fruit, but even those who produce fruit have been known to have fallen. God is the supreme judge and as Scripture tells us, He judges the heart while man looks on the outward appearance. Let's face it, if we were in charge, many of those God used in the OT and NT probably would not have met our standards.
As for your earlier post about describing the "nudge of the Spirit", that was my Christianease way of saying the Spirit's leading, prompting, etc. in one's life. It's purely subjective in that I do not believe that the Spirit moves the same way in each person's life. One may be spoken to through dreams, another through Scripture, another through creation, etc. That's why being part of a faith community where one can be discipled and taught about the Trinity and then enter into a relationship with Jesus is important. I think it's in that context that one can grow and begin to not only hear God's voice but recognize it. Jesus said that His sheep hear His voice and a stranger they will not follow.
In the OT God set up the judges by seeking those with the following qualities: wise, well respected, and understanding (DT. 1: 13-18). In Acts 6:3 full of the Holy Spirit was added to the above. Then in 1 Timothy 3 the additions of peace loving, having self control, being able to teach, children obeying and respecting , gentle, one wife, etc. were added.
ReplyDeleteI am not sure that these can be screened for in a membership interview...or that they should be.
I think that we judge ech other by our fruit. As Shawn said, we must get to know each other more intimately so that we can discern who is mature enough (1 Tim 3:6) to lead. Not to say we personally must become best of friends ...that would be slightly impractical...but as a whole we will know each other and the reputations of those seeking leadership.